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Armor/AFV: Large Scale
1/16 and Larger Armor Modeling
Hosted by Darren Baker
M151 Protector
caiman
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United States
Joined: March 30, 2012
KitMaker: 12 posts
Armorama: 12 posts
Posted: Thursday, March 29, 2012 - 06:32 PM UTC
Hello. My name is Carlos Fuentes and I am a kit maker enthusiast.
I have been working on a 3d model of a m151 protector.
Just about every nut, bolt, screw,bracket, etc... has been modeled accuratley.
I cannot tell you how many hundreds of hours ive spent modeling this weapon station. I had to make lots of sacrifices and stay up long hours making part after part. I had not shown the progress to anyone untill recently. And it never crossed my mind to have this model made into a real kit untill now.

this model is in 3d for now. But I would like to get some guidance on making this 3d model into a hi end hobby kit.


I will post many pictures of this kit and some other models which I hope to turn into real kits










































































Link to Hi rez images.




http://img854.imageshack.us/img854/3097/protector4.jpg





http://img151.imageshack.us/img151/4425/protector3.jpg




http://img853.imageshack.us/img853/1874/protector2.jpg



http://img856.imageshack.us/img856/1328/protectorn.jpg

afv_rob
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England - East Anglia, United Kingdom
Joined: October 09, 2005
KitMaker: 2,556 posts
Armorama: 2,199 posts
Posted: Thursday, March 29, 2012 - 07:58 PM UTC
Oh man that is insane! I am in absolute awe of how you have achieved this using a computer. My dad dabbles in 3D design and I can only imagine how long this took to achieve.

I'd also personally love to see this realised as a model kit. A large scale M151 would make such an awesome shelf piece.
caiman
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United States
Joined: March 30, 2012
KitMaker: 12 posts
Armorama: 12 posts
Posted: Thursday, March 29, 2012 - 11:02 PM UTC
@Rob: Thank you Sir. Yes the model took a long time to create.
Im glad you like it:) and I agree, Would look great on someones shelf. I hope I can make that a reality soon



some cad screen grabs of the bushmaster cannon






Canjuaan
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Baden-Württemberg, Germany
Joined: June 08, 2007
KitMaker: 228 posts
Armorama: 223 posts
Posted: Friday, March 30, 2012 - 02:08 AM UTC
Wow, Carlos, this is crazy - but in a very positive way

I highly appreciate your efforts. Thanks for making these awesome pictures available. I hope you find a way to make a kit out of it. Maybe a cooperation with Live Resin?

Cheers,
Johannes
Belt_Fed
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New Jersey, United States
Joined: February 02, 2008
KitMaker: 1,386 posts
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Posted: Friday, March 30, 2012 - 03:54 AM UTC
That's truly incredible stuff- a true aren't its own right!
Belt_Fed
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New Jersey, United States
Joined: February 02, 2008
KitMaker: 1,386 posts
Armorama: 1,323 posts
Posted: Friday, March 30, 2012 - 07:06 AM UTC
*a true art in its own right! Silly keyboard!
caiman
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United States
Joined: March 30, 2012
KitMaker: 12 posts
Armorama: 12 posts
Posted: Thursday, April 12, 2012 - 08:22 PM UTC
thanks for the compliments guys..

some new renders






bison126
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Correze, France
Joined: June 10, 2004
KitMaker: 5,257 posts
Armorama: 5,132 posts
Posted: Friday, April 13, 2012 - 04:37 AM UTC
Stunning job ! On the last pictures you could swear it's a real one.
I have a point though, the hole in the muzzle is oversized. Have a look at a true .50cal barrel and you'll see how small the hole appears.
Something easy to fix for you.

Olivier
retiredyank
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Arkansas, United States
Joined: June 29, 2009
KitMaker: 11,610 posts
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Posted: Friday, April 13, 2012 - 04:40 AM UTC
Simply put, WOW!! I would love to see this one in plastic. Sincerely hope that a manufacturer picks this up. Good luck!
slodder
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North Carolina, United States
Joined: February 22, 2002
KitMaker: 11,718 posts
Armorama: 7,138 posts
Posted: Friday, April 13, 2012 - 04:46 AM UTC
You've got our attention for sure.

one quick thing you can do it work on using 3D printing to at least do a prototype. www.printapart.com is a good site to start with, there are other reviews and sites available. As far as getting it to true kit production I would touch base with some of the figure masters and even some of the guys who do sci-fi - Fetchenfoo (spelling?) does masters. Ask them for advise.
tankrou
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Attica, Greece / Ελλάδα
Joined: November 25, 2009
KitMaker: 55 posts
Armorama: 53 posts
Posted: Friday, April 13, 2012 - 07:33 AM UTC
people this is the future of modelling!
sgtsauer
#065
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Missouri, United States
Joined: March 30, 2002
KitMaker: 2,602 posts
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Posted: Friday, April 13, 2012 - 08:48 AM UTC
Awesome work...Olivier is right though, muzzle opening is much too big.
caiman
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United States
Joined: March 30, 2012
KitMaker: 12 posts
Armorama: 12 posts
Posted: Thursday, May 17, 2012 - 10:46 AM UTC
Brent Sauer: thank you. I will adjust the barrel

billy: Thank you:)


Scott Lodder: thank you for the information. Ive started researching and things are looking pretty good.

matt nethery: Cheers!

Olivier Carneau: thank you for pointing that out. Im glad you like my piece.

Sorry for not updating!!
Ive decided to take this model a step further and add a character. Im still working on this. Ill try to post some more updates soon








I have a question. If I were to produce this model. How much would you pay for this kit?
caiman
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United States
Joined: March 30, 2012
KitMaker: 12 posts
Armorama: 12 posts
Posted: Monday, May 28, 2012 - 06:09 AM UTC
Wakemeup
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Napoli, Italy
Joined: September 02, 2006
KitMaker: 880 posts
Armorama: 874 posts
Posted: Monday, May 28, 2012 - 06:39 AM UTC
wow!that's insane!!!It's a great work....well..I'm sure you can sell the product but in my opinion you can only sell it in a big scale (1:16 or similar) cause if you do this in 1:35 you've on the market:

Afv club M151 (10 euro)
Trumpeter M151 (10 euro)
Blast Models M151 (12 euro I think)
Blast Models M151a2 (13,90 euro)
Blast Models Crows II (13 euro)

So the market has different ways.I'll pay for your work...in resin...15 euro euro...if you'll add pe parts maybe 18-20 euro...for a piece of art maybe more than 20 euro.
If you'll do a bigger scale work I assume that in 1:16 I'll pay around 40 euro...then you'll need to add shipping costs.
Of course....it's only my opinion.
Keep up the great work!!
Ciro
tankmodeler
#417
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Ontario, Canada
Joined: March 01, 2004
KitMaker: 3,123 posts
Armorama: 2,539 posts
Posted: Wednesday, May 30, 2012 - 02:26 AM UTC
Carlos,

The first thing you have to establish is if you can be happy making $4-5 profit per kit in 1/35 (assuming $15-20 each retail sold from your own web site). You're simply not going to get much more from it once all the costs are added up. Be a businessman first and sort out the market, costs (including postage), selling price and profit margin. Do that first before you potentially waste time with what comes below.

If it looks good from a business point of view, you then have to establish that your 3D software will export the model as a 3D STL file or a STEP file. These are the two formats necessary to generate the 3D prototype.

Then you need to break down the entire assembly into the sub assemblies that will actually be the parts built by the modeller and cast by the casting house. When doing this you have it imagine how the kit will go together and how it will be cast. You may have to add assembly guides, holes and pips to your 3D model so that it can be built and aligned by the modeler. You may also have to sacrifice some details or split some parts into two so that the caster can get detail on both sides. You'll need to work with the casting house after you've made an initial cut at breaking down the assembly into parts for casting.

If you are making this in 1/35, assume you are going to lose some of the finest dewail. You can retain detail down to about 1mm in 1:1 scale if you are using the finest prototyping services. Check with them to see what level of detail they can reproduce.

Understand that even the best prototypers will give you back parts that need some clean up to be suitable for reproduction. All of these processes lay down material in layers and those layers need to be at least coated with something like Future or Mr. Surfacer 500 and then gently sanded with 600 grit to make them mirror smooth. THis will also cost you some detail.

Once you have your first prototype in hand, dry fit it all together. You may need to make changes before you do the final filling and smoothing.

Don't be concerned about manually adding detail to the prototyped parts. Happens all the time. In fact it can work best to make basic shapes in CAD and then add some details manually to the prototypes (althought I do see that you've got pretty much everything possible in your 3D model).

To avoid large file sizes and long printing times (and costs) simplify your model wherever possible. If you have modelled all the fasteners completely and the holes and threads they go into, get rid of ALL of that detail from the model and simply model just what can be seen on the surface. Remember, anything smaller than 1mm (.040") in real life will simply disappear on the prototype in 1:35. Your wallet will thank you for it and the prototyper will get a simpler file that is much less likely to crash or produce odd results. (this happens a LOT)

Be prepared to produce files for the prototyper that are the exact size of the final parts you want back. If you have made the model in 1:1 in CAD, scale it down to 1:35 or 1:16, whatever, before sending the STL exports off to the prototyper. Make sure the scaling is correct before you send it off and then ask the prototyper to measure some parts in their system prior to actually printing the parts. Cross check to see that your measurements and their match! Measure twice, print once!

I've done this a few times both for work and for modelling and these are a few of the lessons I've learned.

HTH

Paul
chukw1
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California, United States
Joined: November 28, 2007
KitMaker: 810 posts
Armorama: 75 posts
Posted: Wednesday, May 30, 2012 - 03:23 AM UTC
Beautiful, Carlos- just beautiful! What program do you model with? Here at blur studio our guys model in 3DSMax. Outstanding cg, my friend- cheers!

chuk
caiman
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United States
Joined: March 30, 2012
KitMaker: 12 posts
Armorama: 12 posts
Posted: Thursday, May 31, 2012 - 07:31 PM UTC
Chuck Wojtkiewicz: Thank you for stopping by! I am very glad that you like my work.
Thats awesome that you work at Blur by the way!!! You guys make some top quality CG.
To answer your question about what program I use. Its actually top secret military software.....
Just kidding! I use 3ds max and autodesk fusion. Hope that helps.

Paul Roberts: Thank you for the advice. Ill make sure to do my home work and ask questions before investing money. Ill also make sure to double check and triple check my files to ensure a quality finished piece. Thank again.

Ciro: thank you for the kind words!!

. I modeled the pin connectors and a couple of other small parts. all thats left is the wiring and its done. I have been slacking on that a bit tho to be honest. Only because I do not have any wiring diagrams . So I have to rely on a few images to guess how the entire wire harness is setup on this thing.. I do not like guess work but Im sure it will turn out fine.

























caiman
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United States
Joined: March 30, 2012
KitMaker: 12 posts
Armorama: 12 posts
Posted: Wednesday, August 14, 2013 - 01:11 PM UTC
Edited
hliu24
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California, United States
Joined: November 19, 2010
KitMaker: 798 posts
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Posted: Wednesday, August 14, 2013 - 01:50 PM UTC
how about 1/35 xm153 crows2? your 151 looks amazing, but not like 153 (mounted on lots of vehicles and abrams), I can only use it for old strykers.

regards

jay
ubisuck
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Quebec, Canada
Joined: December 20, 2012
KitMaker: 461 posts
Armorama: 255 posts
Posted: Friday, November 29, 2013 - 11:09 PM UTC
Maybe he could add your Protector in this?

Fred444
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United States
Joined: October 14, 2014
KitMaker: 1 posts
Armorama: 1 posts
Posted: Tuesday, October 14, 2014 - 05:48 AM UTC
[quote]Sorry for not updating!!
Ive decided to take this model a step further and add a character. Im still working on this. Ill try to post some more updates soon

I am amazed for the work you put on this project!! I can tell (by personal experience with the system) that the details you present are as close as 99% accurate. Really accurate.
I'm sure that you know that the M134 Common Remotely Operated Weapon Station (CROWS II) is a system that allows the operator to be inside the vehicle that serves as platform carrying it into combat. The idea of having a character added is nice but defeats the real concept and use of the system. Never the less you have made an awesome work on this model and would like to know how far are you to have it in the market. I'll be in line to get one (or 2) as soon as it becomes available.