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Armor/AFV
For discussions on tanks, artillery, jeeps, etc.
News
AFV Club: IDF M109A2 Doher
varanusk
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ARMORAMA
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Santa Cruz de Tenerife, Spain / Espaņa
Joined: July 04, 2013
KitMaker: 739 posts
Armorama: 524 posts
Posted: Monday, November 13, 2017 - 08:57 PM GMT+7


New photos with details of AFV Club's Doher kit.

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If you have comments or questions please post them here.

Thanks!
ReluctantRenegade
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Wien, Austria
Joined: March 09, 2016
KitMaker: 1,225 posts
Armorama: 1,220 posts
Posted: Monday, November 13, 2017 - 09:04 PM GMT+7
I really can't comment on the actual accuracy of this kit is...but it looks awesome!

Vodnik
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Warszawa, Poland
Joined: March 26, 2003
KitMaker: 4,092 posts
Armorama: 3,691 posts
Posted: Monday, November 13, 2017 - 10:20 PM GMT+7
The kit is certainly interesting for IDF fans, but I don't understand why AFV Club call it "M109A2". While the howitzer has been significantly upgraded by IDF, probably even beyond the basic A2 variant capabilities, it is clearly based on M109A1 howitzer version with a small turret w/o the extended ammo storage in the bustle.
Sleepwalker71
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Singapore / 新加坡
Joined: August 30, 2012
KitMaker: 105 posts
Armorama: 96 posts
Posted: Tuesday, November 14, 2017 - 05:00 AM GMT+7
Several sources point out M109A5 as a base of Doher howitzers.
Vodnik
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Warszawa, Poland
Joined: March 26, 2003
KitMaker: 4,092 posts
Armorama: 3,691 posts
Posted: Tuesday, November 14, 2017 - 07:37 PM GMT+7

Quoted Text

Several sources point out M109A5 as a base of Doher howitzers.


I don't think so. I'm not sure if IDF ever got any A5s. Most sources list A1 and A2 variants as base for Doher. The AFV Club kit is clearly A1 based Doher. Maybe Doher firing equipment is equivalent to that of A5, but I highly doubt any of them are built on actual A5 base vehicles (which e.g. used a newer gun - the same as A6 Paladin, not the same as earlier A1-A4 variants).
ReluctantRenegade
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Wien, Austria
Joined: March 09, 2016
KitMaker: 1,225 posts
Armorama: 1,220 posts
Posted: Wednesday, November 15, 2017 - 03:04 AM GMT+7

Quoted Text

I don't think so. I'm not sure if IDF ever got any A5s. Most sources list A1 and A2 variants as base for Doher.



AFAIK, all M109 based IDF SPGs ('Rochev','Doher','Dores') are based on the A1 variant. There are a few A2 examples too, but I'm not sure whether these were received to be used as experimental vehicles for upgrades, or did see actual service in artillery units.


Quoted Text

Maybe Doher firing equipment is equivalent to that of A5, but I highly doubt any of them are built on actual A5 base vehicles (which e.g. used a newer gun - the same as A6 Paladin, not the same as earlier A1-A4 variants).




The M109 modernization project called 'HIP' (Howitzer Improvement Program) was a joint venture between the US Army and the IDF. The project's aim was to upgrade existing units to A6 level. Although the IDF pulled out of the project after two completed units only, SOME of those improvements, together with a few local upgrades, were implemented (from '95) in the 'Doher'. These locally upgraded units can't be called neither A5 (because of the different gun) nor A6 (only certain elements of the A6 upgrade level were implemented). As Pawel (rightly) pointed out, AFV Club's latest offering is clearly based on the A1 variant yet it's labelled as A2. I really hope the actual kit is accurate...
Taeuss
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Manitoba, Canada
Joined: January 03, 2016
KitMaker: 1,259 posts
Armorama: 1,254 posts
Posted: Wednesday, November 15, 2017 - 04:21 PM GMT+7
And here I was just pleased to have something cool to build...
Vodnik
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Warszawa, Poland
Joined: March 26, 2003
KitMaker: 4,092 posts
Armorama: 3,691 posts
Posted: Thursday, November 16, 2017 - 02:47 AM GMT+7

Quoted Text

And here I was just pleased to have something cool to build...


Oh, the model is very cool. It is just the name on the box that isn't right, not the kit itself
ReluctantRenegade
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Wien, Austria
Joined: March 09, 2016
KitMaker: 1,225 posts
Armorama: 1,220 posts
Posted: Thursday, November 16, 2017 - 03:23 AM GMT+7
I think this is one of the two examples of the cancelled 'Yair' project (as the 'HIP' was called by the IDF).