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Armor/AFV: Modern - USA
Modern Armor, AFVs, and Support vehicles.
Hosted by Darren Baker
New Paint for US Armor
exgrunt
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Massachusetts, United States
Joined: December 17, 2013
KitMaker: 267 posts
Armorama: 267 posts
Posted: Thursday, March 21, 2019 - 02:00 PM UTC
Didn't see this coming. New paint is being developed for US Army armored vehicles (M1's, Brads and Strykers). Ground Vehicle Coating System offers lower IR emmisions and is resistant to chemical agents. Looks similar to current paint but still a bit distinct. Whose gonna be first to offer the new paints to the modeling world?

https://defence-blog.com/army/u-s-army-discloses-details-of-advanced-coating-system-for-ground-combat-vehicles.html



drewgimpy
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Utah, United States
Joined: January 24, 2002
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Posted: Friday, March 22, 2019 - 05:46 AM UTC
Is it just me or is the green a little brighter?
Kenaicop
#384
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Nevada, United States
Joined: August 23, 2005
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Posted: Friday, March 22, 2019 - 05:59 AM UTC
Recently saw this too, it does appear to have a different sheen to it. Looks like the road wheels and sprocket are all black, and the gun tube has a wavy pattern the whole length, got that new tank look
18Bravo
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Colorado, United States
Joined: January 20, 2005
KitMaker: 6,450 posts
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Posted: Friday, March 22, 2019 - 06:06 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Looks like the road wheels and sprocket are all black, and the gun tube has a wavy pattern the whole length...



Very Chieftain-esque with the wheels, and British with the wavy barrel. In fact, in the last Brad photo the Green almost looks like the British Bronze.
JavierDeLuelmo
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Spain / España
Joined: February 29, 2016
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Posted: Friday, March 22, 2019 - 12:32 PM UTC
We are looking at FOUR colours (black, brown and two greens), not the usual three.
exgrunt
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Massachusetts, United States
Joined: December 17, 2013
KitMaker: 267 posts
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Posted: Friday, March 22, 2019 - 01:22 PM UTC

Quoted Text

We are looking at FOUR colours (black, brown and two greens), not the usual three.



Didn't notice that before but you're right. Pretty cool to see something new, been staring at NATO-Flauge M1's for close to 40 years now. Will be interesting to see more pics of these vehicles once they are widely deployed and in varying light conditions. I wonder what they'll do for the ERA bricks? Kinda defeats the purpose of developing a new scheme, just to cover it up with mono-tone ERA.
MassimoTessitori
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Italy
Joined: March 14, 2013
KitMaker: 230 posts
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Posted: Saturday, March 23, 2019 - 02:08 AM UTC
Wheels and sprockets seem in dark green, not black.
Kenaicop
#384
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Nevada, United States
Joined: August 23, 2005
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Posted: Saturday, March 23, 2019 - 03:09 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Wheels and sprockets seem in dark green, not black.



You’re correct, I saved the pic and lightened it up, same olive color as the center green, not the lighter color. This is all very interesting, can’t wait to see the end result of all this.
m75
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California, United States
Joined: July 20, 2002
KitMaker: 599 posts
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Posted: Saturday, March 23, 2019 - 03:55 AM UTC
I'm sure the colors are applied by air using templates. The very tight color separation will be a little challenging in model scale, especially 1:72.
salt6
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Oklahoma, United States
Joined: February 17, 2002
KitMaker: 765 posts
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Posted: Saturday, March 23, 2019 - 05:13 AM UTC
I wonder how much IR signature they think they will reduce from a hot metal box.
Kenaicop
#384
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Nevada, United States
Joined: August 23, 2005
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Posted: Saturday, March 23, 2019 - 05:37 AM UTC
Scroll down the comment section, pics of the turret, looks like the turret has been extended out a few inches to the front.

https://www.snafu-solomon.com/2019/03/marines-to-continue-upgrading-m1a1.html#disqus_thread
exgrunt
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Massachusetts, United States
Joined: December 17, 2013
KitMaker: 267 posts
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Posted: Saturday, April 13, 2019 - 12:22 AM UTC
US Army is making it a priority to repaint all those tan European based combat vehicle. Not sure if this Brad has the new paints or not but it definitely has a different pattern than the old NATO-flauge scheme. I like.. (although I do have to wonder if most of this scheme will then be lost under tan or solid green ERA blocks).

Going to need someone to offer up those new paints as well!


https://defence-blog.com/army/u-s-army-prepares-its-combat-vehicles-for-a-possible-russian-attack-in-europe.html
HeavyArty
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Florida, United States
Joined: May 16, 2002
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Posted: Saturday, April 13, 2019 - 12:27 AM UTC
The Bradley in the above article is painted in standard NATO 3-color camo.

trakpin
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Nova Scotia, Canada
Joined: November 03, 2012
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Posted: Saturday, April 13, 2019 - 12:30 AM UTC
looks like tamiya nato green/black/brown to me
exgrunt
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Massachusetts, United States
Joined: December 17, 2013
KitMaker: 267 posts
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Posted: Saturday, April 13, 2019 - 03:08 AM UTC
[quote]The Bradley in the above article is painted in standard NATO 3-color camo.

You might be correct. To me it looked like the green and brown were a different, light shade. Also, in the case of this Brad, doesn't it look like they are using a different pattern from the standard NATO-flauge paint scheme used from the cold-war forward?

EDIT - in looking at some older pics, I think I'm mistaken on the pattern. It does appear to be unchanged.

Still am curious if they are going to repaint all the tan ERA blocks in 3 color camo. If not, kinda pointless to spend the time painting the sides, etc since if they ever go to war, those areas will be covered up with tan or green bricks.
M4A1Sherman
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New York, United States
Joined: May 02, 2013
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Posted: Saturday, April 13, 2019 - 03:39 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Is it just me or is the green a little brighter?



Color photos can be misleading, due to the following factors:

a. Interior-lighting
b. Film speed
c. Age of the film used
d. Camera settings
e. Time of day, and see "f", below
f. Weather conditions, i.e, sunny, cloudy, partly cloudy, partly
sunny, (don't jump down MY throat, that's what the US Weather
Service says), rainy, snowy, sand-stormy, thunder-stormy, etc.
g. The idiot holding the camera

Paint colors can be "factory-new", sun-bleached, lightly-to-heavily-weathered, etc. There are also paint-color "alternates"- Ask ANY auto paint shop; the same applies to "Military Spec. paints". Pigments and paint formulae VARY from manufacturer to manufacturer, and between the SAME manufacturers' different PAINT LOTS...

Lastly, ask ANY ophthalmologist- They will tell you that NO TWO HUMANS will perceive the very same color in the same way. In short, dear Friends, "color" is subjective, at best...

YOUR comments above ALONE, attest to that fact...

Choose your various, numerous and different paint colors, and be happy...
M4A1Sherman
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New York, United States
Joined: May 02, 2013
KitMaker: 3,921 posts
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Posted: Saturday, April 13, 2019 - 04:32 AM UTC
[quote]
Quoted Text

The Bradley in the above article is painted in standard NATO 3-color camo.

You might be correct. To me it looked like the green and brown were a different, light shade. Also, in the case of this Brad, doesn't it look like they are using a different pattern from the standard NATO-flauge paint scheme used from the cold-war forward?

EDIT - in looking at some older pics, I think I'm mistaken on the pattern. It does appear to be unchanged.

Still am curious if they are going to repaint all the tan ERA blocks in 3 color camo. If not, kinda pointless to spend the time painting the sides, etc since if they ever go to war, those areas will be covered up with tan or green bricks.



You MAY want to ask your local congress representative about that- IMO, you'd be wasting your time if you did...
BunkerBuster
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Washington, United States
Joined: March 29, 2017
KitMaker: 132 posts
Armorama: 99 posts
Posted: Saturday, April 13, 2019 - 06:18 AM UTC

Quoted Text


Quoted Text

Is it just me or is the green a little brighter?



Color photos can be misleading, due to the following factors:

a. Interior-lighting
b. Film speed
c. Age of the film used
d. Camera settings
e. Time of day, and see "f", below
f. Weather conditions, i.e, sunny, cloudy, partly cloudy, partly
sunny, (don't jump down MY throat, that's what the US Weather
Service says), rainy, snowy, sand-stormy, thunder-stormy, etc.
g. The idiot holding the camera

Paint colors can be "factory-new", sun-bleached, lightly-to-heavily-weathered, etc. There are also paint-color "alternates"- Ask ANY auto paint shop; the same applies to "Military Spec. paints". Pigments and paint formulae VARY from manufacturer to manufacturer, and between the SAME manufacturers' different PAINT LOTS...

Lastly, ask ANY ophthalmologist- They will tell you that NO TWO HUMANS will perceive the very same color in the same way. In short, dear Friends, "color" is subjective, at best...

YOUR comments above ALONE, attest to that fact...

Choose your various, numerous and different paint colors, and be happy...



I agree completely. I've foolishly taken paint color advice from other modelers, only to determine they must be color blind. I'm sure that's not actually the case, it's more likely they do their modeling under florescent lights. I switched over all my lighting to LED 5K lighting and it changed my perspective on modeling.
joepanzer
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North Carolina, United States
Joined: January 21, 2004
KitMaker: 678 posts
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Posted: Saturday, April 13, 2019 - 06:30 AM UTC

Quoted Text

I wonder how much IR signature they think they will reduce from a hot metal box.



That's the first thing I thought of too. In the Army, They told us our BDUs would be IR resistant too. Until you washed them twice.

The Advent of thermal imaging makes it a bit obsolescent?
M4A1Sherman
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New York, United States
Joined: May 02, 2013
KitMaker: 3,921 posts
Armorama: 3,876 posts
Posted: Saturday, April 13, 2019 - 06:59 AM UTC

Quoted Text


Quoted Text


Quoted Text

Is it just me or is the green a little brighter?



Color photos can be misleading, due to the following factors:

a. Interior-lighting
b. Film speed
c. Age of the film used
d. Camera settings
e. Time of day, and see "f", below
f. Weather conditions, i.e, sunny, cloudy, partly cloudy, partly
sunny, (don't jump down MY throat, that's what the US Weather
Service says), rainy, snowy, sand-stormy, thunder-stormy, etc.
g. The idiot holding the camera

Paint colors can be "factory-new", sun-bleached, lightly-to-heavily-weathered, etc. There are also paint-color "alternates"- Ask ANY auto paint shop; the same applies to "Military Spec. paints". Pigments and paint formulae VARY from manufacturer to manufacturer, and between the SAME manufacturers' different PAINT LOTS...

Lastly, ask ANY ophthalmologist- They will tell you that NO TWO HUMANS will perceive the very same color in the same way. In short, dear Friends, "color" is subjective, at best...

YOUR comments above ALONE, attest to that fact...

Choose your various, numerous and different paint colors, and be happy...



I agree completely. I've foolishly taken paint color advice from other modelers, only to determine they must be color blind. I'm sure that's not actually the case, it's more likely they do their modeling under florescent lights. I switched over all my lighting to LED 5K lighting and it changed my perspective on modeling.



Thanks, Ken!

BTW- I don't use fluorescent lights ANYWHERE in my home...
M4A1Sherman
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New York, United States
Joined: May 02, 2013
KitMaker: 3,921 posts
Armorama: 3,876 posts
Posted: Saturday, April 13, 2019 - 07:15 AM UTC

Quoted Text


Quoted Text


Quoted Text

Is it just me or is the green a little brighter?



Color photos can be misleading, due to the following factors:

a. Interior-lighting
b. Film speed
c. Age of the film used
d. Camera settings
e. Time of day, and see "f", below
f. Weather conditions, i.e, sunny, cloudy, partly cloudy, partly
sunny, (don't jump down MY throat, that's what the US Weather
Service says), rainy, snowy, sand-stormy, thunder-stormy, etc.
g. The idiot holding the camera

Paint colors can be "factory-new", sun-bleached, lightly-to-heavily-weathered, etc. There are also paint-color "alternates"- Ask ANY auto paint shop; the same applies to "Military Spec. paints". Pigments and paint formulae VARY from manufacturer to manufacturer, and between the SAME manufacturers' different PAINT LOTS...

Lastly, ask ANY ophthalmologist- They will tell you that NO TWO HUMANS will perceive the very same color in the same way. In short, dear Friends, "color" is subjective, at best...

YOUR comments above ALONE, attest to that fact...

Choose your various, numerous and different paint colors, and be happy...



I agree completely. I've foolishly taken paint color advice from other modelers, only to determine they must be color blind. I'm sure that's not actually the case, it's more likely they do their modeling under florescent lights. I switched over all my lighting to LED 5K lighting and it changed my perspective on modeling.



You know, IMO, the new AK-INTERACTIVE "REAL COLORS" are WAAAAY too light when compared to the REAL THING, which I've done. Could it be that someone at AK was color blind..?

Or is it just me..?
TopSmith
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Washington, United States
Joined: August 09, 2002
KitMaker: 1,297 posts
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Posted: Sunday, April 14, 2019 - 03:35 AM UTC
Induced scale effect?
M4A1Sherman
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New York, United States
Joined: May 02, 2013
KitMaker: 3,921 posts
Armorama: 3,876 posts
Posted: Sunday, April 14, 2019 - 03:41 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Induced scale effect?



That's probably what AK had in mind, but I don't subscribe to that line. IMO, "induced scale effect" is a lot of hogwash...
Frenchy
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Rhone, France
Joined: December 02, 2002
KitMaker: 11,904 posts
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Posted: Sunday, April 14, 2019 - 04:30 AM UTC
This new Ground Vehicle Coating System can be applied to tires as well (no more wheel painting masks ) :

https://www.armymantech.com/pdfs/GMPGVCSPPI.pdf

H.P.
BunkerBuster
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Washington, United States
Joined: March 29, 2017
KitMaker: 132 posts
Armorama: 99 posts
Posted: Sunday, April 14, 2019 - 04:39 AM UTC

Quoted Text


Quoted Text

Induced scale effect?



That's probably what AK had in mind, but I don't subscribe to that line. IMO, "induced scale effect" is a lot of hogwash...



Is there a specific color you have observed as being off? I've compared some of their colors to the MM enamel equivalent and they are very close matches.