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Cars: Muscle Cars
60's & 70's Classics
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Ferrari F50 Barchetta Build review
Szmann
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Netherlands Antilles
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Posted: Saturday, March 07, 2020 - 05:04 AM UTC
Those are all correct assessments, Joel! I run myself into above-mentioned problems. For me it is easy because I have no contests to participate physically and a model is as good as the pictures are.
For narrow gaps I use Vallejo Acrylic putty, very easy to wipe out, not shrinking. The problem is that doesn't sand, but breaks in chunks. This is why I'm using solvent based putties for "body work" kind of job.

CA Glue gel and marine grade epoxies make also excellent putties, but they dry very hard and they are a pain to sand back down. I use CA gel for larger gaps, but I won't use it for panel work.

Gabriel
Joel_W
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Posted: Sunday, March 08, 2020 - 02:20 AM UTC
Gabriel,
I also use that Acrylic putty and it's great for small seams, etc. But for me because I use water to smooth it out as you can't sand it, I'm compacting it and the seam still shows. So 2 or 3 applications is necessary. Of course when I need to fill a small gap and the seam is really there, it's a perfect choice.

Joel
Szmann
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Posted: Sunday, March 08, 2020 - 09:53 AM UTC
Update

My loosing battle with the Ferrari engine continues...
The larger gaps were filled with acrylic putty (white). The hairline gaps were filled with Tamiya Surface Primer Grey harder to see in the picture, because the primer it's also grey. I had to "paint" with liquid putty almost every single join line. The proud standing pin marks were cut off or sanded, the recessed ones were filled. I removed as many seam lines I could reach to. I corrected the bends in the exhaust pipes and I filled up the gaps where the pipes join the mufflers. Now has been primed again and the witch hunt continues...


On the other battlefront I am slowly winning. The body parts primed with Mr. Surfacer 1500 Grey, thru H&S Evolution 0.4mm @20psi. I used a thick mix (approx 50%), because I wanted the primer to act as a micro-filler as well.
If you noticed it, I primed the body from the interior too, because I wanted to block the translucence of the plastic. Three coats were requited! Many modelers that had the bad luck to work with red or yellow plastic, complained about how hard is to cover these colors. The problem is that the light travels thru the plastic, the same way a LED or the light stripes work. Covering only the exterior surface of the model doesn't help. Applying many coats helps for opacity, but leads to other problems. The solution is to apply the primer or paint from inside - as many coats as necessary, and only the strictly needed coats on the outside.


As anticipated, a shadow of the gap reappeared on the quarter panel. Also more filler needed at the ends:


The interior painted. Yes, I have used the primer as a base coat, sprayed thru the same airbrush, but thinned approx 2 parts primer to 3 parts solvent, because I wanted a more "wet" and more smooth application.


On both the body and the interior parts I've got good results. The body needs more work, especially the rear quarter, but the interior parts are OK and ready for clear coat before decals.

Cheers!
Gabriel
Joel_W
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Posted: Sunday, March 08, 2020 - 10:14 AM UTC
Gabriel,
the body primer/sealer should let you paint the shell any color that you want to. I've never had to deal with Red or any bright plastic color, so this is all new to me.

But I've got another Revell Roush Mustang that is molded in Red. So If I'm going to be painting it Red, then should it matter? Plus the interior of the shell will be Red as well.

This is why I really prefer a neutral gray plastic or white, not pre-colored. I'm thinking that they went that route as the kit is geared towards younger builders who most likely wouldn't paint it

Joel
Szmann
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Posted: Sunday, March 08, 2020 - 10:39 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Gabriel,
the body primer/sealer should let you paint the shell any color that you want to. I've never had to deal with Red or any bright plastic color, so this is all new to me.


Joel, the primer can affect the final color, because what is called "optical mix". The light travels thru the thin coat(s) of paint, until encounters an opaque surface (the body shell in our case) and reflects back. In its way back, the color refractions get mixed up, depending on color temperature. Remember my build on Chrysler 300C ? I think you have asked at the time which one is the real color of it. Oh, well, it was blue on the cold light and green in warm light, because of that phenomenon. Now, some pigments are naturally weaker than others, and not all colors are as susceptible as red and yellow - the weakest pigments.


Quoted Text

But I've got another Revell Roush Mustang that is molded in Red. So If I'm going to be painting it Red, then should it matter? Plus the interior of the shell will be Red as well.


In this particular case it should't matter that much, but don't be too surprised if the shade of the red is different in the jar and on the first coat(s) on the model! The devil here is the translucency of the plastic, that absorbs and redirects the light instead of refracting it.


Quoted Text

This is why I really prefer a neutral gray plastic or white, not pre-colored. I'm thinking that they went that route as the kit is geared towards younger builders who most likely wouldn't paint it


Yes, the white plastic has the best refraction index, and thus high opacity. The grey is less reflective, but it is neutral and the optical mix doesn't suffer, although a poor red, let's say, it's gonna look "dull" on the first coat. I've got that on my VW Beetle build, where the first orange coat wasn't at all the ne from the bottle. The second one worked better and the color more vibrant. That's why I'm applying now gold or tan under yellow and red, and silver under white as undercoats. That's exactly what I'm going to do on my Barchetta

Gabriel
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Posted: Sunday, March 08, 2020 - 11:19 AM UTC
Excellent information Gabriel, worth keeping in mind when dealing with those ugly coloured kits.

Great work on the Prep and Primers stages so far, I'm sure you will overcome the weaknesses in the kit mouldings. BTW I hear that the mould designer is now working in the Siberian salt mines

Cheers, D
Szmann
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Posted: Sunday, March 08, 2020 - 11:27 AM UTC

Quoted Text


Great work on the Prep and Primers stages so far, I'm sure you will overcome the weaknesses in the kit mouldings. BTW I hear that the mould designer is now working in the Siberian salt mines

Cheers, D



Thank you, D.! Yes, the primer went quite nice on the outside of the body, with the slightest "dusting" inside the "nostrils", quite unavoidable due the shape of the bonnet.
As for the mould master, what can I say?! Some people are just born under a lucky star! (Muhahaha!)

Gabriel
Joel_W
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Posted: Monday, March 09, 2020 - 01:48 AM UTC
Gabriel,
I'll 2nd what D just said.

I did a little more research on this Red color issue with some fellow modelers (unfortunately, not members in our community). One who built the Ebbro F1 Lotus 49B in the Red and Gold color scheme had all sorts of issues with the Red plastic bleeding through even the lacquer based primer and distorting the Gold. He ended up stripping the shell parts, then priming and a undercoat of Silver of all colors. Then the Red which as you said the actual color in the bottle and the Gold was then dead on.

I'd gladly settle for every model to be molded in neutral gray plastic. That would have saved me countless hours even with my Roush Mustang.

Joel
Szmann
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Posted: Monday, March 09, 2020 - 02:33 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Gabriel,
I'll 2nd what D just said.

I did a little more research on this Red color issue with some fellow modelers (unfortunately, not members in our community). One who built the Ebbro F1 Lotus 49B in the Red and Gold color scheme had all sorts of issues with the Red plastic bleeding through even the lacquer based primer and distorting the Gold. He ended up stripping the shell parts, then priming and a undercoat of Silver of all colors. Then the Red which as you said the actual color in the bottle and the Gold was then dead on.
Joel



That fellow's modeller experience (and many others I've seen on YT and random forums) proves exactly my point, but just a few seem to understand the phenomenon. The corect diagnostic leads to the corect cure. If you block the translucency of the plastic from all parts (inside and edges inclusive), any primer will do. If you prefer to spray only from outside the shell, any undercoat with a high reflective index will do (silver and gold work best).
My favorite color for plastic molding would be either light grey either tan (!) color.

Cheers!
Gabriel
Szmann
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Posted: Monday, March 09, 2020 - 12:02 PM UTC
Minor update

Apparently Joel and I were struggling with decals during the last days. As in Joel's case, my CF decals are one sheet and I have to cut myself the templates. quite tedious work and easy to screw up. I did a few mistakes, but I had not enough patience to redo the decalling. However, in most visible parts, the decals are looking acceptable. There are still to be applied on dashboard, door cards, engine cover and inner rear fenders. F-50 it is built almost entirely from CF, but the called out parts are the most obvious on the real model.
In parallel, I went on with the seats detailing - I'm not done yet, but the main colour scheme is laid.

Cheers!
Gabriel
AussieReg
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Posted: Monday, March 09, 2020 - 01:08 PM UTC
Looking very nice so far Gabriel! What is your process for cutting the templates? I can envisage laying down masking tape and trimming it to the area to be decalled, then lifting it off and using it to cut a card template.

Looking forward to the next update, you are moving quickly on this one!

Cheers, D
Szmann
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Posted: Monday, March 09, 2020 - 01:26 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Looking very nice so far Gabriel! What is your process for cutting the templates? I can envisage laying down masking tape and trimming it to the area to be decalled, then lifting it off and using it to cut a card template.

Looking forward to the next update, you are moving quickly on this one!

Cheers, D



Thank you for following up, D.!

You have described quite accurately my decal fitting. I lay first masking tape over the plastic part. When I have compound surfaces, (like in this particular case the part behind the seats running all the way to the door sill mats), I use multiple pieces of tape together. I trace the contour to be cut pretty much like applying BMF: first with a toothpick to establish a sharp margin, then with a pencil or fine pen. I remove the tape, and I trim it close to the cutting line, then I move it on the CF decal sheet. I cut the contour thru both masking tape and decal paper simultaneously with a very sharp #11 blade. I prefer to keep some "paper bleed" on the masking tape, because I noticed that the cut edges remain cleaner when cut thru the tape and decal paper than when cutting thru the decal alone.

I try to move quick because I'm running out of time. My March is expected to be very busy and I really want to catch the beginning of Strip... Campaign, whose beginning coincides with the second edition of TCC.
Cheers!
Gabriel
Joel_W
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Posted: Tuesday, March 10, 2020 - 11:56 AM UTC
Gabriel,
The interior to date is really shaping up. The CF decaling looks dead on perfect. Are those your own CF decals?

Joel
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Posted: Tuesday, March 10, 2020 - 02:10 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Gabriel,
The interior to date is really shaping up. The CF decaling looks dead on perfect. Are those your own CF decals?

Joel



Thank you, Joel! Yes, these decals are produced by BlackLight Design.

Update - CF done but more to come
I found the contrast between 2 components of the CF a little too sharp - especially after checking my online references - so I applied a filter. BLD decals are printed on transparent film, and the underlying color is very important. It also allows to replicate modern CF shades, like the ones deployed by Konigsegg (blue, red, holographic white).


The effect is more visible on more exposed parts. Also, the filter dealt with my few mistakes:


A clear coat will follow after the smoke filter, to add more depth and also to blend further the difference between matte black and the glossy fiber. I know the details look a little confusing now, like some sort of dazzling scheme, but the following stages will address the issues.


And that was about interior CF bits, but there is more in the engine bay...

Cheers!
Gabriel
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Posted: Wednesday, March 11, 2020 - 12:45 AM UTC
Gabriel,
The door panels look really quite good. Looking forward to how the smoke coat alters the look of the CF as it gets toned down.

Joel
Removed by original poster on 03/11/20 - 14:18:31 (GMT).
Szmann
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Posted: Wednesday, March 11, 2020 - 02:50 AM UTC
Sorry for the deleted post, KM Network works awfully slow and the previous upload was timed out - the post was empty.

Joel, the decals were already sprayed with Tamiya Smoke as a filter and as a gloss coat. The following gloss coat will be acrylic, so I can use oil wash.

UPDATE

This is my second go to the rear quarter panel. It looks much better now, but perhaps no further refining it's possible - at least on the right side - because the plastic is by now paper thin with sanding


The primer applied previously on the main shell was quite good, so a little wet sanding with 3000 grit was all it needed. Also some overlooked seam lines were corrected:



The removable roof was also sanded, and you can see here how easily the red bleeds out wherever the polishing was a little more energetic


Gabriel
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Posted: Wednesday, March 11, 2020 - 04:34 AM UTC
You're making excellent progress, my friend. I have full confident, in you winning this battle.
Szmann
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Posted: Wednesday, March 11, 2020 - 06:05 AM UTC

Quoted Text

You're making excellent progress, my friend. I have full confident, in you winning this battle.



Thank you so much, Jesper, for stopping by. Yes, if the Modelling Gods are not playing pranks, I'm gonna win eventually The engine is surrounded and will surrender soon.

Cheers!
Gabriel
Joel_W
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Posted: Thursday, March 12, 2020 - 08:19 AM UTC
Gabriel,
You're beating this Italian beast into submission for sure.

Interesting plan of attack:
The next steps on the body: black primer - sanding - gold undercoat - red base coat - sanding - 2K - if it works flawlessly.

That's a lot of paint layers. If You're going to go with a Black #1,500 Mr. Finisher primer, I'd sand down the gray primer to save a layer.

Joel
Szmann
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Posted: Thursday, March 12, 2020 - 01:19 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Interesting plan of attack:
The next steps on the body: black primer - sanding - gold undercoat - red base coat - sanding - 2K - if it works flawlessly.

That's a lot of paint layers. If You're going to go with a Black #1,500 Mr. Finisher primer, I'd sand down the gray primer to save a layer.

Joel



:) It sounds like one or two too many, right? Well, the black primer it substitutes actually what the second coat of gray should have been. I have used grey instead of black at the beginning from logistic reasons - I just have a bigger stock of gray and the interior alone ate me three coats. The initial gray was polished or sanded whatever the case on the exterior surfaces, and I'm not too afraid of a build-up. I would be a little worried about the metallic undercoat, because I'm gonna use Rust-oleum from tin can and these paint are rather thick and they have large metallic flake. But, again, I prefer one coat of Rust-oleum than two-three coats of Alclad, both as time economy and as cost cutting. I'm gonna keep one eye on the panel lines after the gold coat and redo them if necessary, although I doubt. I have a rather "light hand" when comes about airbrushing, even when I use large setup (0.4mm)

UPDATE - black is the new grey
Once I decided that my undercoat will be gold, it makes more sense to use a black primer. This is the reason I chose to apply the second coat in black instead of grey.
The usual grains here and there, mostly under the spoiler and inside and around the front "nostrils", but nothing to have me use bad words, and thus OK.








The rear quarter it still has a little visible line - and I haven't decided yet if I should sand again or just ignore it and go forward. Luckily, it is more prominent on the left side, where there is still some plastic thickness left under the primer.


Cheers!
Gabriel
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Posted: Thursday, March 12, 2020 - 08:35 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Gabriel,
You're beating this Italian beast into submission for sure.

Interesting plan of attack:
The next steps on the body: black primer - sanding - gold undercoat - red base coat - sanding - 2K - if it works flawlessly.

That's a lot of paint layers. If You're going to go with a Black #1,500 Mr. Finisher primer, I'd sand down the gray primer to save a layer.

Joel



Every auto enthusiast knows that working on Italian cars is a pain in the rear. The beast is looking good.
Joel_W
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Posted: Friday, March 13, 2020 - 01:44 AM UTC
Gabriel,
The black primer looks smooth and consistent. I'd say you nailed it to a T.

Joel
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Posted: Friday, March 13, 2020 - 03:22 AM UTC

Quoted Text


Every auto enthusiast knows that working on Italian cars is a pain in the rear. The beast is looking good.


Yes, indeed. And the Germans copied the example under dealers's pressure. Regular maintenance on modern Porche, high end Audi and Ferrari require lifting off the engine from the body. A few of them not even have an engine hood anymore, let alone the transmission dipstick! Crazy! I better buy a Ford T


Quoted Text

Gabriel,
The black primer looks smooth and consistent. I'd say you nailed it to a T.

Joel



Thanks, Joel.
Yes, "business as usual" kind of priming session. A little sanding here, a little polishing there and she'll be good for gold undercoat.

Gabriel
Szmann
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Posted: Saturday, March 14, 2020 - 09:34 AM UTC
UPDATE - Gold fever!

After I wet sanded the whole body with a spent 3000 grit Tamiya sponge, I have applied the undercoat for the red. I used canned Rust-oleum Brass enamel diluted with MLT. This was for the first time that I never had lines of different flakes.

Here's the secrets I found today:
1. Shake the hell out of the can
2. Let rest for couple minutes
3. With a pipette, suck paint right from under the surface of the paint, avoiding oils and free floating flakes
4. Mix well with MLT
5. Fill up the AB cup
6. Spray outside the surface of the model a couple seconds, until the heavy flakes from the bottom of the cup are expelled, and continue the move on the surface.
7. Spray as usual, observing "rule" #6.



No grit to talk about, and no metallic flake "rashes". I feel almost guilty now that I have to cover it in red!

Gabriel